Talk:Auto-Translator: In-Depth
Wings of the Goddess Job Translations Hey guys, I was trying to find dancer and scholar on the main page but was unable to do so. I was wondering if anyone else had noticed they were missing? I'll add the English versions on the main page, but the others will have to be left blank until someone can fill them in. 12:28, 6 March 2008 (UTC) Long page This page is going to get to be extremely long; the listing I have of the raw phrases by themselves, with no formatting to speak of, is fairly huge in itself. Does anyone have suggestions for how to split it up, or whether to even bother? Thanks- --Eleri 01:46, 9 August 2006 (EDT) ---- Don't think it will be a problem. --Gahoo 13:46, 9 August 2006 (EDT) ---- When I was perusing some of the walkthroughs on wikipeida, they had one broken down into sections. Where there were the links to each section at the top. Step 1 was shown below, click on step 2, brings up an identical page and step 2 was shown, and so on. Could do something like that for each section you have I suppose. --Emizzon 01:53, 10 August 2006 (EDT) ---- I think it's perfectly fine, there's the table of contents at the top to jump to any particular category. Took me 2 seconds to find what I was looking for. ^^b --Kaeli 14:42 11 August 2006 (EDT) ---- Hmm. If general opinion is that I shouldn't break it up, I'll leave it as is, but it was still the longest page on the wiki by a pretty clear margin when it was only half-done. I'll leave it up to you folks to decide. (*'_') The TOC does make it fast and not so problematic, so the only real problem is the fact that it's just... long. Scrolling can be difficult without the TOC and the load time might get a bit unmanageable maybe. But yea, if you guys think it's OK as is, I won't split it. --Eleri 15:30 11 August 2006 (EDT) ---- I personally think that keeping it all on one page increases usability, especially for people who are used to doing text searches on the pages--it's really easy to do them in Firefox by pressing the forward slash key when a text box isn't in focus. I can just load the whole page and search for a term I'm looking for. If it were split up into sections I would have to figure out where to look for the term first--It isn't the end of the world, but it just adds an extra step. The only drawbacks I can see is increased bandwidth usage for the host and longer load times for people on dialup. --Ichthyos 15:50, 11 August 2006 (EDT) ---- I think it is fine also and propose it stays as is unless someone complains. However, as an alternative, you could do the following. Maybe expand the intro a bit and then have subpage links. The first of which is the whole guide as here. Then if people want to link there and run a search they can. The other subpages would be section by section. --Gahoo 15:53, 11 August 2006 (EDT) Awesome Looks awesome Eleri, Keep it up!!!! --Reinhardt ---- Looking great! I can't wait to use it!--Eddie 19:24, 9 August 2006 (EDT) ---- I personally believe this may end up the most important page on this Wiki. --Sakaki22 16:04, 10 August 2006 (EDT) ---- I agree, I've already used it. Wanted to make sure "(Ship)" was the boat and not the act of delivering something. ^^; --Kaeli 14:39 11 August, 2006 (EDT) This is helping me a LOT, especially since i have jp pol and its hell to get autotrans to work. keep up the good work! (as a side note, it'd be cool if someone could hack the items database and grab a list of all of those names ...but, that doesn't necessarily belong here) --Pandora Xero of Asura 02:01, 4 December 2006 (EST) ToC Feel free to delete it but the autogenerated one was just so long it seemed needed. --Gahoo 15:40, 14 August 2006 (EDT) looks good to me, gahoo. thanks. (b'_')b --Eleri 15:48, 14 August 2006 (EDT) Suggestion Many JP's refer to Dynamis currency as , I think because 裏 can be translated as "old" as well? (I don't actually speak Japanese; I'm just trying to remember my JP friend's explanation.) I think it'd be nice to point that out here. :) --Ichthyos 14:44, 24 August 2006 (EDT) There is a section that is left out from the auto-translate, it's the Area category. This should definately be an area addressed for the purpose of one word that is under that category: Sub. The English: {Sub} could mean many things, but for the most part used in reference to Subjob. Japanese version translations this to　サポウェポン(sapo wepon) which is phonetical for the English word "support weapon". Epicus 5:47, 20 September 2006 (EDT). I'm not sure about the alternative meaning "old" for 裏. It might just refer to Dynamis as some sort of alternate world, "behind" the real Vana'diel. And I think that "sub" would refer to sub-weapon (サポ - sapo), this being the equipment area, rather than support weapon, which would be サポート - sapo-to. --Eithin 13:24, 23 September 2006 (EDT) Title I would like to move this to Auto-Translator: In-depth? Any objection? I have none, the capitalization has been bugging me. --Chrisjander 10:17, 14 September 2006 (EDT) How about: Auto-Translator: In-Depth?? --Nynaeve 10:46, 14 September 2006 (EDT) Mijin Gakure For the explination of mijin gakure: the two kanji making 'mijin' together like that means, "atomic" or "particle". For gakure, the 'ga' is a subject relational and 'kure' or 'kureru' means to 'come to an end'. yar, i had 'atomic explosion' in the original version of this. someone changed it and, assuming they knew better, i left it that way.... i'll fix it up. --Eleri 15:26, 17 September 2006 (EDT) Linguist Wannabes... a plea from a billingual player orz I've spent a couple hours going through the romanizations and fixing them. It's really great that people are adding stuff in but Jim Breen's J-dict does not equal knowing japanese. I can tell some (not all) people are using some kind of online dictionary for some of the kanji. Please if you don't know the romanization, leave it blank! Someone will eventually fill it in with the right romanization! I've tried to fix some romanization errors as well as make some spacing in romanization so it's not too horribly-long-to-read. Hopefully, more people can work on this.--VZX 13:30, 18 September 2006 (EDT) ---- you know, one of the first things i did when i started this guide was ask for help from bilingual players. i got no answers, and none of my bilingual friends were willing to proofread it at the time. so i did the best i could with a limited knowledge of japanese and the j-dict, hoping as the guide got popular, someone like you would come along and help me out with it. thanks for the additions! ^^ but like, i did my best, and i wasn't going to create the guide with nothing but blank spaces... better to have had no guide at all than blanks imo, so i guessed given what i did know. i dunno, other people have been okay with it. the wiki relies on fixes like this to make it the best. (b'_')b --Eleri 00:56, 19 September 2006 (EDT) ---- Excellent article, I breezed through it and learned many a things I will take under advisement when forming parties or dealing with players of Japan. I wanted to say thank you for your hard work. Breaking it up probably isn't a terrible idea. For example, breaking it into articles on translations behind Skill Chains, article on magic, etcetera. You could unite them again with a basic summaries page that includes a more descriptive means to politely engage in auto translated conversation (as well as *behavior*) with Japanese players. If a chart is too small to be in an article, you could group them together. Question and Answers, Tactics and Party arrangement, etcetera. At the top of these smaller articles, you could include a brief summary of how to go about discussing these things with Japanese players, especially considering the importance of politeness and tact when engaging in party tactics with higher level Japanese players. I don't think a Japanese player with several level 75 jobs would deeply enjoy being told what to do. This would take the article to even further depths of interaction, and gives you room to compound more social enlightenment. Something that too many American players genuinely *need*. You're making FFXI a better place. -Greix 17:08, 19 September 2006 (EDT) ---- I think that's better be made in Guide category. Since, I think, this page would be better if we strictly discuss about words/phrases in Auto-Translator function. Well if someone propose it (for in depth conversation in Japanese, not Auto-translator), I probably can help edit some of the section too. --VZX 03:51, 24 September 2006 (EDT) Items/Key Items Needs a subsection on how to get Items and Key Items in the auto-translator. Often I see stupid things like this: (Airship)(Pass):O When you can simply press TAB, hit up twice for the 'key items' submenu and look for it there and it will come out with no confusion in the auto-translator as (Airship Pass) for everyone to understand. Ditto for items you have or want to buy. The catch is that you must have opened your mog safe or own inventory, or have browsed someone's bazaar or the auction house OR an NPC sales list for that item before the 'Items' menu even appears in your auto-translate completions list. Once you've opened it though any items listed therein will function as normal auto-translation completions (without the need to press TAB). Example: I'm trying to sell my apple pies on a mule and I feel like advertising in my search comment. First I open up my inventory and double-check for those pies. Yup, all there. Then I edit my search comment: Hit Tab and press up once for "Items." Lucky me it's alphabetical and yup, opening it has 'Apple Pie' right up top. Now I can exit that menu type "App" and hit TAB once and pow there's (Apple Pie) right in my autotranslator and set the price in my search comment. ---- This is not needed, as the actual page that describes the Auto-Translator and how to use it already has a section detailing this. --Chrisjander 17:45, 22 September 2006 (EDT) Automaton JP names I saw a post on a forum that said the PUP Automaton models' names were named after Zodiac signs. Can someone confirm this? Regardless, it would be nice to know what the Japanese names for each of the 4 existing frames is. --zoogelio-forgot-his-password 22:31, 17 October 2006 (EDT) Can't found any Japanese Zodiac Name in automaton list--VZX 02:44, 18 October 2006 (EDT) world pass How do you translate world pass? I have a lot of ppl JP and EN that ask me about how I get my sprout beret (used to ask more, now, not quite as much), I used to say: gold , but if doesn't apply there... is there another way to say that? Or has SE failed there? Well, on this note, yes, works, further, would work, wouldn't work PERFECTLY, but it would most likely be understood. the only part that MIGHT throw the JP players off is the "gold" in "gold" and, please sign your comments --Pandora Xero of Asura 02:21, 4 December 2006 (EST) German Translations I've made a few corrections to some of the German translations--mainly spelling errors. Viylais 22:15, 29 April 2007 (EDT) Note from main contributor: Stop changing things unless you KNOW you're right if anyone has a problem with me reversing a lot of the recent edits that were made to this page this past weekend, tough. i've made it my business to know the ins and outs of the autotranslator and get at least a basic grasp on what means what in ambiguous cases, what's used when, what SHOULD be used when, and what i'm typing. several of the edits made to this page were simply wrong; for example, yatta or super are not signs of 'okay!' they're signs of 'hurray!' so don't change it to say it means okay. that's wrong. take care is not supposed to be used at the end of a party, it's supposed to be used to warn your puller to be careful because he's trying to pull in kuftal tunnel when guivre is up. if a note has been added by another user, it's probably been checked out and is correct. talk it out on the discussion page if you think it's incorrect. and for heavens' sakes, i don't even WANT to know why someone completely changed the german text of 'decent challenge.' that was just wrong. i can take a screenshot of the autotranslated string coming through in both english and german for you if you want. also, thank you, but notes of interest don't really need to be added to say things like 'good morning' in japanese actually means good morning. shockingly enough, that's actually pretty logical, and i'd like to save the special notes for things that are worth noting. to those who are fixing my typos and adding notes worth noting: thank you. very much. love you guys, you make this article great. :D --Eleri 19:15, 30 April 2007 (EDT) : Hi, 'Yatta!' in Japanese means 'Hurray' but also 'Yeah!', then again, I guess this can left out :). As for 'Hello!' I just mentioned it's a morning-only greeting as many English-language players use it regardless of the time of the day, although it's really meant to be used only in the morning in Japanese. For all the changes I made, I was confident I was right and didn't put anything in that wasn't verified. Some of the information on Japanese and French phrases is unfortunately incorrect and I meant to fix it as well as add new information. Then again, I guess some things may be redundant... --Fii 12:48, 2 May 2007 (EDT) Discussions of certain edits alright, i was asked by Mierin to delineate all of the edits i have a problem with, since someone else has repeatedly changed them back to what he believes is correct. *'see you again!' - a note keeps being added that the literal french translation of 'until next time' means 'see you again.' it's simply not noteworthy to say that the meaning of a literal translation is the meaning that's already listed there. it's logical and unnecessary. notes are for things that are noteworthy. we know that somewhere in the grand scheme of things, whatever the literal meaning says, it's going to trace back to the intended original meaning. *'take care.' - the translation of this in french is 'pay attention' and in japanese is essentially something like 'be cautious.' this is a warning. it's a notification. it's not a farewell and, while it IS often used when parties disband because of people misunderstanding its intended use, it isn't SUPPOSED to be. that's why i wanted this note out of this guide. if you want to put something in here about how it's ambiguous in some languages, okay, but in some languages it's absolutely not intended as a farewell, and if a meaning isn't present across all 4 translations, it shouldn't be presented as the intended meaning. *'welcome back' - in the interest of picking my battles when i fixed a lot of those edits, i left this one alone, but the note on 'welcome back' stating that 'bienvenue' is ALSO a formal way to say 'you're welcome' was removed. i don't know why. i found that interesting and quite noteworthy, and it's not an incorrect observation. it's my opinion that it needs to be put back. that's all for now.... tell me when i can fix these things again please.... ._.a --Eleri 09:48, 1 May 2007 (EDT) :Hi, I thought these had been reversed by mistake as there were many changes in a short time. :*'see you again!': Okay :) although it seemed a little strange to me to mention the literal meaning which seems a little less relevant than the actual meaning, but point taken. :*'take care.'/'faites attention.' This in French means 'be careful', not 'pay attention' (which would be something along the lines of 'soyez attentif !'). And in Japanese it is definitely used mostly when disbanding, as this phrase is mostly used to mean "be careful (on the way back)" in everyday life, but I understand this can be left out as it concerns only Japanese. However, saying the French means 'pay attention' is not correct. :*'bienvenue' is not, at least in modern French, a way to say 'you're welcome' (as in 'thank you/you're welcome'), it only has the greeting/reception sense. Just to make sure, I checked in Trésor de la Langue Française and le Robert and neither mention this. The person who added this may have gotten confused with another word, but it's definitely incorrect. --Fii 12:42, 2 May 2007 (JST) ::re: 'see you again!'... the difference in literal meaning, while it's true that it's not as pertinent, is there simply as a point of interest. this is how the japanese say see you again, this is how the french say see you again, and so forth. ::re: 'take care'... the farewell meaning is still ambiguous and inconsistent across the four languages. i don't want it saying it's meant to be used when disbanding a party unless it makes sense in all four languages, and it doesn't. if you want to change the note to state that in some languages it can mean both, okay, but i want it made very clear that the more correct meaning is that of 'be careful.' ::re: 'bienveune'... i asked the person who added that note to respond to you, and he did, so i'll stop dealing with that one. --Eleri 09:50, 2 May 2007 (EDT) :::Hi, I see what you mean about 'take care.' I only meant that about the Japanese sentence. If you think the comment is out of place, let's just leave it out then :) ::::Ooh, I've checked the phrase and you are totally right, it is unclear and incorrect the way it is, my mistake for adding 'French' in the middle and not fixing the rest of the sentence. I'm fixing it now, I hope it sounds okay now ^^; --Fii 23:44, 2 May 2007 (JST) I would not have made an edit to say that Bienvenue had a dual-meaning of "you're welcome" unless I was sure of it. I am perfectly fluent in French, having spent 12 years of my life in a full French immersion school. When I spent 12 years of being taught that Bienvenue can be used as "you're welcome", I'm fully inclined to believe that IT IS IN FACT TRUE. Regardless of what you may have read in dictionaries or online whatnots, I am telling you, outright, right here, right now, that Bienvenue can also mean "you're welcome". If you wish to continue to disagree, I can give you the names of about 15 different FRENCH TEACHERS (including 4-5 of them that are either from France or Quebec) who would be more than willing to prove you wrong. Unless you know for a fact (and when you have someone who knows the language telling you otherwise), please stop changing it. Thanks. Also, for the record, AS someone who can speak the language, and have ended quite a few conversations in French, and have made partings using French, I can say, with 100% certainty, that NO ONE SAYS FAITES ATTENTION when parting ways. While you may sit here and say that its literal is "be careful", it still means the same thing. "Soyez attentif!" is a literal to mean pay attention, as in, you aren't paying attention in class, and that you are being scolded for not doing as much. "Faites attention" DOES mean be careful, but it is used, as has been said, as a warning, to be careful, as there is danger nearby. A French parting is simple, as are typical partings in English. "A prochaine" (until next time), "au revoir" (another way of saying until next time, literally "until we see each other again"), or even "bonjour" (good day) when you feel like being casual, are typical parting statements. NO ONE will every say "A prochaine, faites attention". The FRENCH equivalent to the ENGLISH "Take care" is something along the lines of "bonne souhaites", which literally means good wish, or best wishes. Please don't debate this with me either. You clearly do not know the language, and are using internet resources to validate your information. I am fully fluent in the language, and I know how conversational French works. Please don't argue this with me, because what you are reading on the Internet is text-book French, and doesn't cover the little things that exist throughout all languages (Take care in English is even an example of this). --Toxictaru 10:03, 2 May 2007 (EDT) ::Hi, first not need to get overly heated about this. ^^; Like I stated before, I know for a fact "bievenue" doesn't have this meaning in French. I'm pretty confident about my French ability, since I'm a native French speaker, born and raised in France with French education, and have myself taught French to foreign students in college for a few years as well ^^;. I think I can say I know the subject pretty well :P ::But I asked a couple of French friends about this just for the sake of having another opinion, and they agreed with me. The only way I can see you could've heard would be that it is from a local French dialect (Québec, Sub-saharian Africa etc) or ancient French. Were the persons you were in contact with native speakers? Were they from France or other countries? If it's a regional dialect, it may be better to mention so. The speakers you have been in contact with may not have been speaking standard French. But I'm adamant it's not used in standard French with that meaning, and you can trust me on this :) ::I never said someone said "Faites attention" when parting, I said that about the Japanese phrase "気をつけてください". Sorry for the confusion, if the wording wasn't clear. ::It's kind of funny you said I don't know the language, when I've also fixed several spelling mistakes in the French words and added some translated meanings. Sorry, but for a debate like this I'd value the opinion of a native speaker (or 3 in this case, if I count my friends) more than that of someone who has just studied. The dictionaries I mentioned were pure reference -as you probably know since you've studied French, the Robert is considered a reference for the French language. By the way, "souhait" is spelled without an E, and if you find a native French speaker who'd actually want to prove me wrong on 'bienvenue', do send them my way :) --Fii 23:29, 2 May 2007 (JST) :::For someone who claims to know the language, and is NATIVE, you clearly have some problems understanding the language. I strongly disbelieve that you are French. However, you do carry their arrogant attitude. I'll stop here, actually. My points have been made, and whether or not you wish to believe me, thats fine. I was educated in French, while I did not TEACH French, I was considered among one of the best French tutors in my city. I've spent time taking extra French courses during the summer, IN places such as Quebec, and to be honest, everything that I have said here have been accepted, and are taught, to be correct. If you can't accept that, thats fine, but clearly, you want to prove yourself right, and ignore the fact that other people KNOW they are. I am done here. I have nothing left to say to you, and if you continue to make incorrect edits, I will continue to go back and change them. --Toxictaru 10:54, 2 May 2007 (EDT) ::::No you won't. The purpose of this discussion is to avoid an edit war. If I find you perpetuating an edit war, I will suspend your account. Whatever resolution is reached here, will be the final resolution of what appears on the front page, whether you agree with it or not. Please do not insult or attack other editors whose opinions matter just as much as yours. The capital letters and direct insults are completely unnecessary. I will not tolerate intimidation tactics here. --Mierin 11:09, 2 May 2007 (EDT) ::::Hello, judging by your replies in this thread, I 'm afraid you don't have a proficiency in French suited to argue with a native speaker on linguistic issues. All I can suggest, since you won't take my word, is that you check with another native speaker on the 'Bienvenue' issue. Contrary to what you claim, nobody uses that phrases meaning 'you're welcome' in standard French, that would be considered an anglicism. Just like nobody says "bonjour" or "bons souhaits" (you must be confusing with Bonne journée or Bonsoir) when parting. It might be some sort of local dialect, in which case I still don't think it's relevant to have it on this page. --Fii 13:51, 3 May 2007 (JST) :::::on the contrary... you guys are sitting here arguing back and forth about whether it's exactly or perfectly proper. that's not the sort of thing this guide cares about. pardon my inability to post the following with the japanese characters intact, i'm on a bad work computer that won't let me install japanese support. :::::it's got abbreviations. Example from 'signet': Notes: When not using the Auto-Translator, Japanese players will sometimes abbreviate this to シグ.' :::::it's got connotations and gutter-minded alternate meanings. Example from 'team up?': Notes: Japanese- Literally "Shall we play together?" Note that the verb in this sentence (just like in English) can have a sexual connotation colloquially. :::::it's even got joking misuses. Example from 'hill': Notes: Sometimes used jokingly as an abbreviated form for おかえり, or {Welcome back.}, in much the same way that an English player would use {May}{Bee}. Example from 'claymore': Notes: Japanese players often use this as a pun for くれも (kure mo, comparable to kudasai) which roughly means "please". E.g. {Protect}{Claymore} would really mean protect please. :::::if some guy from quebec raises me and responds to my 'thank you' with 'welcome back,' i want to know why. i don't care whether it's popular or correct, i just want to know why. if you weren't taught this, fii, but toxic was, it doesn't matter who's correct... what matters is that some french speakers might use this. it's noteworthy. i'll put an addition to the note that it's uncommon, but it's noteworthy and belongs in this guide. :) --Eleri 08:20, 3 May 2007 (CDT) ::::::First, I don't see why this Edit war is pursued when the resolution states the note is irrelevant and should be removed. Even if this expression did exist, which remains to be proved, it would not be standard French and if some people actually used it, most French speakers would see this note on the Wiki as a mistake like me. This expression does not exist in standard French, this is something you can easily verify by asking any native French speaker. If you really want it added to the page, then you should research if it actually exists and if it does, explain what region it is from/what century it was used in. You can't say "a French speaker would say" because that's not true, it's just incorrect/incomplete the way it is phrased. --Fii 9:34, 9 May 2007 (JST) :::::::i don't know what else i can say here that doesn't involve repeating myself. a lot of things that are in this guide aren't standards. whether it's standard is not relevant. the fact that JPs sometimes refer to dark knights as 'souleater' is not standard. the fact that 'please let me join' can have a sexual connotation in japanese is not standard. the japanese puns from 'claymore' and 'hill' are not standard, nor is the english usage of '{may}{bee}.' the guide isn't meant to show what's standard, it's to show what's odd, rare, and interesting. when i pointed this out to mierin, he said that adding a note that it was rare or potentially incorrect should be fine to suit both sides of this argument. :::::::players don't always speak standard english, standard japanese, standard german, or standard french when they're playing this game. the standard is not the point. --Eleri 11:53, 9 May 2007 (CDT) Resolution *'see you again!' - notations not necessary *'take care.' - "be careful" ... note may be added that in Japanese it can be a farewell (if this is true). I believe the concensus is that it is *not* a farewell in French. *'bienvenue' - I don't understand the purpose of this argument. The auto-translate has it for 'Welcome Back'. For the 'You're Welcome' it says 'De rien.' Even if bienvenue also can mean "You're Welcome," that is irrelevant, because when an NA uses 'You're Welcome' to a French person, it will appear 'de rien' and when a French person uses 'bienvenue', it will appear 'Welcome Back' to an NA. So whether or not it has duel French meanings, really doesn't matter. Correct me if I'm wrong, please. I believe the purpose of this page is to ensure that there is less confusion between languages. An NA would use 'You're Welcome'/'de rien' and get the correct meaning across. And whether or not a French speaker would use 'bienvenue' as "You're Welcome", the purpose of this page is to explain to them that it comes across only as 'Welcome back' to an NA. --Mierin 12:03, 2 May 2007 (EDT) :While poking around Mierin's talk page, I noticed Fii mention that the note had been added back. I honestly don't see the problem with the note at all. There are situations where it can and will be used as an expression of thanks, and users should be informed as much. If users suddenly start getting {Welcome back.} after saying thank you, it is likely to confuse some people. {hill}{picture}{Blade: Rin} is likely to confuse an English player, but to Japanese players it does (it means Welcome Back, coincidentally), much like {May}{Bee} is understood by English players, but not by Japanese. Japanese players will also use {Rear} as their universal translation for Dynamis, but that is once again not understood by players who are NOT Japanese. I don't see the difference here. :I will mention, however, that I have a screenshot of a French player using Bienvenue as a thank you. It was not auto-translated, but it exists. The point needs to remain that if SOME people can use it in that form, it should at least have a note saying that it CAN be used differently than intended. No one has disputed the Japanese dual-meanings, I don't understand why this one was so hotly contended. -- 14:08, 1 June 2007 (CDT) gate breach i just saw a japanese player using {Garliage Citadel}{Gate Breach}{Can i have it?} so, it seems like jp's do infact understand it (or, atleast some). not going to add it to the note on the page, as i've never heard of any other jps using it like that. however, i thought it was worth mentioning Rog 16:52, 7 June 2007 (CDT) :understood, thanks. ^^/ --Eleri 17:46, 7 June 2007 (CDT) Abbreviated Place Names Someone's been changing the English Place names on this page to how they were changed by accident in the last update (example: Hall of the Gods to Gods'Hall). As this was just an error that was since corrected, these really shouldn't be left as they are now. - --Noodles355 04:54, 30 June 2007 (GMT) go for it? --Eleri 08:01, 30 June 2007 (CDT) sure when I have like 5 free hours >.>;; --Noodles355 19:56, 30 June 2007 (GMT) I just pulled up an old history before it was changed and pasted that section back. Hopefully it is all still the same, please overview and see if there is anything that was missed. -- 13:47, 30 June 2007 (CDT) looks fine, ty. i like how everyone wants -us- to make 5hr edits but won't do it themselves. :P --Eleri 16:05, 30 June 2007 (CDT) Got it in one :P now get back to work slave! (actually it was more a "hey let's do it as a community" kinda thing, I sure as hell wouldn't expect one person to do it alone...--Noodles355 22:33, 02 July 2007 (GMT)